Honestly it always makes me laugh when peoples (especially Tech "journalists" ) act like it's some sort of discovery, as if it was some sort of conspiracy they suddenly uncover while it's something that nearly everybody knew for years and that Microsoft never try to hide.

Microsoft is no longer a software publishing company, they are a cloud services provider, Microsoft greatest competitor/opponent is Amazon (i.e. AWS), not Apple or Linux, heck if anything I am pretty sure they makes more money selling Linux based solutions than they make by selling Windows.

So yes it's very obvious that Microsoft will try to include cloud service in everything including Windows, everything they did in the recent years went in this direction, the "you need a Ms account to install Windows 11" has nothing to do with DRM or them being afraid of piracy but everything to do with them wanting peoples to uses their cloud services and that starts with peoples having a Ms account. The reason they try to push Neon and get rid of Win32 ? same thing, having legacy application makes the system less secure, which is not good when you want peoples to trust your ecosystem both local and cloud based.

But personally I don't think that Linux is as a safe heaven as people make it to be. Android is open source and Linux based but when it comes to spying it's user, DRM and cloud based stuff it's even worse than Windows, yes you can install a custom version... but the majority of peoples uses Android because of the Google apps and Play stores, those installing from APK and other stores are marginal at best.

And even desktop Linux doesn't fare really better, it's a "free" OS sure... but does it really matter if you use it to play Denuvo protected Steam games, watch Netflix / Disney +, etc... streamed video, listen Music on Spotify , and in general uses exactly the same online, cloud based, services than on any other OS, etc... peoples don't need to install "spyware" in your OS when they already know, and more important can sell, 99% of what you are doing online.

For me the whole Linux vs Windows debate is outdated, ironically Linux kinda won, Microsoft embraced it like they embraced open source and became one if not the biggest contributor, seriously I wouldn't be surprised if Windows 12 or 13 is open source or even Linux based.

That's not extreme, what you wrote before was ("I saw the right-click menu in 5 seconds and instantly uninstalled!!!!"). Anyway this is a pointless debate, sorry you disliked it. Just saying for my purposes I barely notice a difference.

Also in reply to other points, I really doubt MS would try and make every Windows PC a subscription. They'd be throwing away their biggest advantage, which is being on office computers across the world. They're definitely gonna keep pushing Office 365 type stuff, but a constant internet connection and $10 a month fee to use Windows? Nah.

Just wait until Windows 13. It'll be called Windows S or X or whatever, and then it'll be Windows XIV. And then they'll stop calling it Windows and call it Microsoft Pathways or whatever.

It's been at least a week, so yeah, time for the GoG forums to have another one. It also conveniently ignores that under the hood, Windows 11 is also basically the same as Windows 10.

OP also forgets Windows 2000 (basically XP for adults who don't like silly colours on the start menu)

I would disagree on "under the hood", since that's where I see most improvements (not just the rounded window corners and different colored context menus :D), they got rid of a lot of old junk and keep improving kernel functions, but they kept compatibility for sure.
UI wise, what they started in Windows 8 - replacing the old system control panel programs - slowly but steady becomes something usable. I still prefer the old interfaces, but I'm quite an oldtimer. I hate it that all external devices are all listed in the same menu (printers, webcam, blue tooth headsets, paired smartphones all on the same page ...) with some properties not accessible from there. But for some functions the system control panel is not needed anymore at all. They're getting there.

Always thought you had to be rather creative with the versions for that saying to work...
For me it's more like 95>good, 98>poor, ME>bad, 2k>poor, XP>good, Vista>bad, 7>good, 8>awful, 8.1>bad, 10>terrible, 11>horrifying... And also noting that 7 was pretty much the only one that was good quickly, the good XP being mainly SP2+ and the good 95 being OSR2.

This is one of those discussions I'm glad I can watch from the side. But for the matter of historical context:

Windows 1.0-2: Worthless, barely even noteworthy as a historic footnote. 3.0: Iffy. A big improvement, but still not there. 3.1: We've arrived at last.

3.11: A slightupwards improvement and the baseline for the then upcoming NT. So therefore, even if you try to use the "Trek Movie Fallacy", there's too many versions that the entire trend gets bucked.
Gnome and the GTK are what Comstar is to Battletech: What was once a useful hub for communications, research & development mutated into a crystal spires & toga cult.

I prefer Window Managers. ;p

When I was saying they were the same under the hood, what I was really trying to say is that fundamentally given the way that MS were running updates (two big updates a year), 11 is basically what 10 was going to become anyway. Personally, I like that they have moved away from "10 is the last ever Windows" and are now a bit more honest in terms of the ongoing development and what it means.

Lot of different opinion here and even confusing stuff. For me, i am the one in charge when it comes to the OS i use and to me Win 11 is clearly terrible.

Actually, almost anything from the new generation is terrible. So i was ordering me the last Notebook i still want to own... a honest one and not way overpriced... 2k bucks should be sufficient and i found 2 interesting ones:

Old generation: Gigabyte Aero OLED
-Win 10 Pro (old but good)
-3070, this is a very honest GPU with the correct labeling
-I7 11800H (this is a honest 8-core CPU, no E-core junk, simply a good old CPU)
-AMOLED 60 Hz 4k with accurate color, the stuff that really matters to me... and good black without blue light... you are not gonna run 120 Hz on a Notebook... even a huge Tower can have hard work doing so, so lets be honest. Heck, most of the games i still run on 60 Hz using a 3090 TI... maybe i switch to 120 Hz (will also mean to get ride of the Plasma that simply is working for over 10 years already) when i got a 4090 TI... not sooner than that.

There is a newer one, the not so humble new era:

New generation: MSI Stealth OLED
-Win 11 Home (less feature please... because the new OS is so "supreme" already). A OS intended to move toward the "right direction":... away from customers and more toward the center.
-4060, barely faster than the 3070. Actually the 4060 is the new donkey-monkey supposed to be a cashcow. Because people can barely afford something even more money-bloated, so they beg to be able to get "at least" this one. A 158 mm2 die, not even half the size of the 3070 die... and transistor count is about equal... which is a joke for a new gen.
-I7 13620H, barely better than the 11800H in game performance (because it lacks 2 full performance cores)
-OLED, 1440P with 240 Hz... wow... i wonder how i will syncing it with the FPS... no way... there is just not enough muscles, but okay... this was my second Notebook i was considering and if there is any chance to still catch the first one... i know what fits my needs best.

Okay, RAM is always on the "low side" for Notebooks not more than 2k, but it can be upgraded... on those machines.

I am not gonna eat this "low era" junk... i think the only hardware that truly made a good advancement is the 4090, however... this GPU is crazy expensive. All the other stuff... is barely better at all. And with additional crap added. No thanks! Although, on Notebooks there is still the thermal issue and anything above "mid range" i consider simply to hot and to much power demand. Around 100 W is fine, but not much more than this... So actually, a good midrange makes "the best sense".

Regarding OS... yeah, this Win 11 is disgusting, i really hope everything is working and i still can get me this "old gen"... as a backup for my gamer PC. I now have to wait for months... not easy to get. The new machine is no issue to get at all... those Win 11 machines are catching dust already, it seems...
No "huge run" for the new machines... most gamers find it ugly and it seems they are not dumb at least on that matter.

This is actually the first time in history i wish to get "older hardware", todays world is simply upside down...

My worst nightmare would be a OS which is entirely cloud-based, and indeed... Windows is currently moving slowly toward that direction. So far, on Win 10 it can be excluded but on Win 11 this is harder already and on Win 12 it is probably not avoidable anymore. So, indeed it could become even worse... but this is just a wild speculation because no one really knows the final outcome. As long as the customers are not enjoying Windows 11, and this is so far absolutely the case because the Win 10 users are still the overwhelming majority and in general the sales of new hardware is in a clear decline; so the industry even is slowly dropping their prices...

Well, as long as the customers are not enjoying it... maybe Microsoft will have to move toward another direction, because at a certain point it may not work out well for them, However, it all depends on the industry supporting this new OS... and maybe Win 10 could be the OS with the longest support from the gaming industry ever. Although i can no say what will happen with Win 12 or even Win 13... Surely the biggest companys (not always but mostly...) may try to put their games into clouds, together with the OS... for "complete control and a ultimate DRM" regarding their software use. But this needs users to adapt to it... else it will not work. So, they will try to use methods into making it happen. The only chance moving away from this path is in term the users are not willing to adapt to the new policy... which is still unknown.

I mean, to me, Cloud may have some benefits in the backup area. However, if abused it is also a extremely powerful DRM, the most powerful ever possible. Another risk is that the average customers, or mass-customer, is nowadays accepting DRM as a "side effect" of their "so loved launcher-based-platform" which seems convenient to them. Yet they may lack to realize that they may slowly lose control on what they consider "owning" it and considering "their rights to use it in a way they may enjoy". So far it works out for the majority... indeed, but no one knows what will be next.

At some point... this it not even new and i am glad it failed: The entire system will move into a cloud, together with all your data... simply everything... and together with the money-system which is already in a cloud owned by the elitists.. you become livestock whose creative mind is "sucked away" into a cloud as well, and ultimately owned by the elitist in control of this cloud-infrastructures.

All this matters is a nightmare to me because i do believe that a true human should be in control of their things, on their own, no matter what else is affected by it.

I enjoy the idea of having a archive, everyone can access to it... kinda like GoG, which is indeed slowly growing into some kind of archive, although you have to pay for indeed. But i do feel worse for some forced elitist-entities trying to take control about everything you do when it comes to your digital life. So this is the horrible nightmare i may try to avoid at all cost, because at this point the "end customer" may really lose their freedom. They may not notice it for very long time, because they will be lured with a lot of rewards and convenient solutions... so the lazy mass will feel good about for very long time. But at some point they may realize... we have been tricked and now we all have been caged and locked into a big DRM-mess and we lost control... at this point. No matter how "cool and easy" the entire management seems to be... they may start to feel bad about. I hope it will be sooner than "to late"... else i may stop gaming at some point even and only focus on the "good old games".

We can still turn around, but it takes guts and awareness... else i would be rather pessimistic regarding the final outcome.

To me, it is even considered illegal scanning my hardware for their identities... and trying to "lock my access to my own system in term they are not happy with the scanning" which is the way Microsoft is tackling their "Windows DRM". for long time already.. so they are tracking all of your devices info and collecting it on a centralized server. This can exceed much further than this... this act they currently execute is only the very beginning. And, no matter what, it usually... in the long run, will work AGAINST the interests of the majority. Only in the short run it may actually provide lot of benefits because indeed... there is rewards being handed out for "going this way". But, ultimately, it will not be rewarding at all, it is simply a dirty trick abusing our addiction for "short time benefits" we may enjoy.

So... customers should be aware if they do not want to lose control. It might not be that great of a benefit in the long run because it will mainly benefit those "in control of it"...
In my mind, the humans should be able to take control of everything in their life on their own, because they are no puppets and no slaves... in theory at least... because we already have a lot of puppets and slaves and i am sad it turned out like this, in todays world. Hope is still not lost... not as long as enough of people will go another direction...

Anyway, my big heart is on many games from my childhood, it can not be helped because this was the "golden era" at the miillenium age and as long as i can make it last (almost) forever, i will be satisfied. Because this is where my heart is and the other stuff... if it goes down the hellish hole... simply have to live with as long as the mass is not standing up from slavery. GoG is a good way... and as long as it exists i will be supporting it.

The vast majority will always take the path of least resistance and not think anything through...

And those who write dystopias tend to be less creative than those who turn them into reality, in the long run.

Preservation is sometimes better than creation, as long as the creation turns out to be a nightmare.

It is easy to create, because this is the way how life is acting... it is constantly changing. It is however difficult to create something that is a true gain for all the matters important to us and finally enjoyable.

So, we have not to many great creations i feel but indeed, the world is always full of creations.

I try to focus on great creations; the other ones the people hopefully will keep for themself without making it a general rule able to stand in my path.

Regarding "least resistance": It totally depends. If we feel our very existence or something really exorbitant to us, threatened then we magically, as a vast majority, are able to provide "great resistance". Although, it is difficult providing a single condition able to become tagged as "exorbitant" for a vast majority. One of those things is raw cash and/or if our life is in danger... which both is part of our "feeling for existence". Most other matters... we usually do not take it to serious and are willing to accept almost anything like a sheep... not looking out to truly improve something else, as long as it works out somehow with few work done. Actually, humans are lazy... until they feel a threat to their very existence.

Few humans, always minoritys... are driven by the motivation of their heart... some strong "ideals", maybe bad or good dystopias. They usually fail a lot or may not even create anything at all; yet it is sometimes better not to act at all instead of doing the wrong move... because you can only make great creations if not to many worse creations are standing on its path. So, i actually enjoy lazy people more than those really hard working ones, as long as they think their matters through and are sensitive with their creations.

Indeed, almost no one is seeing a OS or a game as something exorbitant, so we usually take everything "with a grain of bad smelling salt", but this is in my mind wrong, as ... it is way more important than we might assume. Our whole life is always more or less affected by IT and media in general, so this is something exorbitant in a certain way.

It's always fun to read the writings of the enlightened minority who in contrast to everyone else are not sheep.
I was a rebel too at some point, no one could ever convince me to try that modern junk called Windows. DOS is forever! And I also insisted on using OS/2, later Linux. Because Microsoft was evil, everyone who did not shut off his brain and started thinking, knew that for sure. We all knew about their shenanigans and how they corrupted the marked (together with Intel). F*** the system, there was always an enemy to fight for us rebels ... good times.

One big question now: Why do you think there is so many "bad creations"; yet it still is able to be successful in general? Maybe because there is still enough of "good" creations?

What will happen if the odds of "bad" creations are increasing? Is there a limit of how much "bad" it is able to handle or is "might" and "support" all what matters to us?

Still, Win 7 was very well accepted, Win 10 too... but Win 11 so far is not at the brightest spot. If you think how many effort MS is doing into spreading Win 11, the success is actually pretty worse. So, in general, the people may not lack the natural feeling of "whats actually made with love and quality", instead of making a matter completely subjective.

So, there is something known as quality, which is not a subjective term.

The problem is, in gaming term, there is a quasi-monopole, because what are you gonna use instead? Linux? Apple? Because of lack of support... unfortunately both are bad options.

Somehow, at least on the console market, there was always some good competitors and on the hardware market there is still some good competition going on (although AMD is slowly turning evil... to much might seems not so good for the character) but on the OS-level... almost no competition. You are basically bound to MS if you want to play games... bound to Apple if you are into graphic-creations... and Linux is for the stuff that is still left. But, there is not a OS which is directly able to compete because every OS got a certain support from a certain industry... so, this is pretty much a "one way ticket".

The only thing we can do, from the outside, is to create "better conditions" toward the customer and the custom of a certain OS. If not, the stuff will slowly going the direction of the companys wishes and there is not much you can do in order to cause a rebellion... with the exception of "not using it at all":.. which is indeed not a tasty option for people who might enjoy a certain software... bound to another software.