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Neverwinter Nights seriesBuy NWN1 ASAP.(140 posts)(140 posts)
(140 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted November 23, 2017
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bioshark: Well first of all, please don't call me a liar. Before I posted my message I have actually done a test with IWD:EE. I went in the goodies section and claimed the IWD classical edition. It DID appear on my shelve and the soundtrack is downloadable from it's "back-up and goodies" section. So everything I've said is true. This is the case for me, I don't know how it is with others. Did it happen to you? Or you just base your facts on hearsay?

On the other hand I've played BG saga since 2001 plenty of times. I have the boxed edition of both BGs and IWD. I have the classical ones on GOG and the EEs on Steam/GOG/Beamdog. So I am a fan of the games. I've played many versions, and TODAY I still prefer the EE version above the others. This is due to all their small improvements they did in order to try to "modernize" the game. This may not be to your liking, that's fine. But it works for me.

The decision to bundle the games was announced months before it happened so anybody who wanted to buy the classical ones could have done it many times. I've never seen a game so much on sale as the classical BG/IWD on GOG. They were even available for 1+ euro at one time or another. I don't think there is a hardcore fan who doesn't already own it GOG. So why all this bitching? I would definitely direct new gamers to the genre to the EE versions.

And yes, without Beamdog this game would not receive any updated content. Sure, there are mods, but they are not the answer to all the problems and needs. There are mods for EE as well.

And why the hell are you so full of hatred and spiteful. You resemble too much a troll in both your attitude and replies. I don't think there is reasoning with you, so you might as well ignore me from now on.

peace.
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Stig79: The soundtrack is showing in you Classic game shelf because you had already bought the classic before it got bundled with the EE version. They can't remove the soundtrack from a product you have already paid for.

They have removed the soundtrack for the classics when you get them via the EE version now, though. The fact that you "just tried this" proves that you already had the Classic version in your library (which you said you did too so...). The soundtrack removal won't affect anyone who whad bought the classic version before the bundling.

So...you said you already had the classic version before you got the EE version. That means it is impossible that you could add the Classic version to the shelf via the EE "extras". Since it is already there. You don't get two classic IWDs on your shelf. So...yeah. Your story does not add up one bit. In fact it is a blatant lie. I tried it out. If you have the classic game already on your shelf....nope. You can't add it to your shelf again. And since you said you already had the classic.....

Yeah the descision to bundle the game was made right after Siege of Dragonspear flopped. They bundled the BG games right after that happened. They claimed it was WOTC who made the descision. They claimed this for about a year or so. Then they started to claim GoG had done it. And once it was revealed that they had been lying all the time, and it was Beamdog who was behind it all, they had to post a public apology right here on GoG. They even had employees running around in here spreading mis-information about their products, and how they were sold.

https://www.gog.com/forum/baldurs_gate_series/regarding_the_removal_of_the_original_ie_games_from_sale_on_gog/page1 It is all here. Links to their lies and screenshots of their lies are included. This is the company you are defending, by the way. Try thinking about that for a bit.

Actually I provided lots of arguments for my points. They countered your lies. Now you are just butthurt and you are trying to play the "you are a mean troll card".

It is not trolling when the person provides evidence for his claims. You got called on your BS. Facts revealed your untruths. That is what happened.
Are you F**** kidding me? I never said I had IWD classic before. I just said I only had EE version for IWD and then claimed the classical which added itself to the shelf. What f*** lies are you spreading around here. Somebody should really ban your account. I never saw so much aggressivity on comments except for trolls. Which makes you a troll.

And again. Never call me a liar. I just explained what I did to IWD yesterday. If I haven't made myself clear from the beginning, that's my bad. I said I own the classics on GOG, but none of them were bought directly. IWD came through EE purchase and the BG one came via gog.com/connect from Steam. There was no reason for me to purchase the classical ones on GOG when I have the boxed ones on my shelf, 1m away from me. And I am no advocate for Beamdog, I just said I like what they are doing and I hope they keep on doing it for a long time to come. If you don't like it, go and hide under a desk.

Please for the the sake of normality never reply to my messages. Better yet, delete your account and never post on forums again. You really behave like a child who's toy was stolen.
Posted November 23, 2017
low rated
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Stig79: The soundtrack is showing in you Classic game shelf because you had already bought the classic before it got bundled with the EE version. They can't remove the soundtrack from a product you have already paid for.

They have removed the soundtrack for the classics when you get them via the EE version now, though. The fact that you "just tried this" proves that you already had the Classic version in your library (which you said you did too so...). The soundtrack removal won't affect anyone who whad bought the classic version before the bundling.

So...you said you already had the classic version before you got the EE version. That means it is impossible that you could add the Classic version to the shelf via the EE "extras". Since it is already there. You don't get two classic IWDs on your shelf. So...yeah. Your story does not add up one bit. In fact it is a blatant lie. I tried it out. If you have the classic game already on your shelf....nope. You can't add it to your shelf again. And since you said you already had the classic.....

Yeah the descision to bundle the game was made right after Siege of Dragonspear flopped. They bundled the BG games right after that happened. They claimed it was WOTC who made the descision. They claimed this for about a year or so. Then they started to claim GoG had done it. And once it was revealed that they had been lying all the time, and it was Beamdog who was behind it all, they had to post a public apology right here on GoG. They even had employees running around in here spreading mis-information about their products, and how they were sold.

https://www.gog.com/forum/baldurs_gate_series/regarding_the_removal_of_the_original_ie_games_from_sale_on_gog/page1 It is all here. Links to their lies and screenshots of their lies are included. This is the company you are defending, by the way. Try thinking about that for a bit.

Actually I provided lots of arguments for my points. They countered your lies. Now you are just butthurt and you are trying to play the "you are a mean troll card".

It is not trolling when the person provides evidence for his claims. You got called on your BS. Facts revealed your untruths. That is what happened.
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bioshark: Are you F**** kidding me? I never said I had IWD classic before. I just said I only had EE version for IWD and then claimed the classical which added itself to the shelf. What f*** lies are you spreading around here. Somebody should really ban your account. I never saw so much aggressivity on comments except for trolls. Which makes you a troll.

And again. Never call me a liar. I just explained what I did to IWD yesterday. If I haven't made myself clear from the beginning, that's my bad. I said I own the classics on GOG, but none of them were bought directly. IWD came through EE purchase and the BG one came via gog.com/connect from Steam. There was no reason for me to purchase the classical ones on GOG when I have the boxed ones on my shelf, 1m away from me. And I am no advocate for Beamdog, I just said I like what they are doing and I hope they keep on doing it for a long time to come. If you don't like it, go and hide under a desk.

Please for the the sake of normality never reply to my messages. Better yet, delete your account and never post on forums again. You really behave like a child who's toy was stolen.
Row, row, row.

You are the one throwing a tantrum like a child, you know. The big bad man caught you in a lie and then you go "Daddy! Make the bad man go away! Delete his account!"

Have fun with that. Millennial, right? Thought so.
Posted November 23, 2017
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bioshark: Are you F**** kidding me? I never said I had IWD classic before. I just said I only had EE version for IWD and then claimed the classical which added itself to the shelf. What f*** lies are you spreading around here. Somebody should really ban your account. I never saw so much aggressivity on comments except for trolls. Which makes you a troll.

And again. Never call me a liar. I just explained what I did to IWD yesterday. If I haven't made myself clear from the beginning, that's my bad. I said I own the classics on GOG, but none of them were bought directly. IWD came through EE purchase and the BG one came via gog.com/connect from Steam. There was no reason for me to purchase the classical ones on GOG when I have the boxed ones on my shelf, 1m away from me. And I am no advocate for Beamdog, I just said I like what they are doing and I hope they keep on doing it for a long time to come. If you don't like it, go and hide under a desk.

Please for the the sake of normality never reply to my messages. Better yet, delete your account and never post on forums again. You really behave like a child who's toy was stolen.
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Stig79: Row, row, row.

You are the one throwing a tantrum like a child, you know. The big bad man caught you in a lie and then you go "Daddy! Make the bad man go away! Delete his account!"

Have fun with that. Millennial, right? Thought so.
Far from being a millennial. I'm probably older than you. And you being so expert at trolling sort of proves it. I tip my had and leave this discussion. Can't reason with trolls.
Posted November 24, 2017
Sort of surprised at two people claiming Neverwinter Nights 1 works on Windows 10 without problems. I've yet to see a Windows 10 setup where it works flawlessly (especially out of the box). If you said that earlier it would've made me very curious why... but now I'm just waiting for the Enhanced Edition.
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ZellSF: They're mostly a blurry mess because of your jpg compression (which actually makes it impossible to see which scaling algorithm is used). They also look low resolution because they are.
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PeterScott: Wow, just full on apologist.

People who aren't Beamdog shills, can see the original Beamdog image:
https://www.beamdog.com/assets/products/31917/original/11.jpg?1511224942

It was just as blurry before I cropped it.
That's easier to look at and it looks like it's integer scaling, which I explained the benefits of. Have some reading:
http://tanalin.com/en/articles/lossless-scaling/
It's the sharpest you can get those assets, without redrawing them (or adding horrible ringing). Do you want Beamdog to redraw the artwork for this game? Because I don't believe they'll able to do that properly and I'm sure people will complain if they do.
Post edited November 24, 2017 by ZellSF
Posted November 24, 2017
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ZellSF: Sort of surprised at two people claiming Neverwinter Nights 1 works on Windows 10 without problems. I've yet to see a Windows 10 setup where it works flawlessly. If you said that earlier it would've made me very curious why... but now I'm just waiting for the Enhanced Edition.
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PeterScott: Wow, just full on apologist.

People who aren't Beamdog shills, can see the original Beamdog image:
https://www.beamdog.com/assets/products/31917/original/11.jpg?1511224942

It was just as blurry before I cropped it.
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ZellSF: That's easier to look at and it looks like it's integer scaling, which I explained the benefits of. Have some reading:
http://tanalin.com/en/articles/lossless-scaling/
It's the sharpest you can get those assets, without redrawing them (or adding horrible ringing). Do you want Beamdog to redraw the artwork for this game? Because I don't believe they'll able to do that properly and I'm sure people will complain if they do.
The portion I pointed out before; the Player portrait and nearby UI elements are Obviously NOT integer (AKA nearest neighbor) scaling.

IS/NN produces obvious pronounced jaggies as pixels are just doubled up. That isn't what happened here.

Engage your brain before you lecture people on things you clearly don't grasp.
Posted November 24, 2017
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ZellSF: Sort of surprised at two people claiming Neverwinter Nights 1 works on Windows 10 without problems. I've yet to see a Windows 10 setup where it works flawlessly. If you said that earlier it would've made me very curious why... but now I'm just waiting for the Enhanced Edition.

That's easier to look at and it looks like it's integer scaling, which I explained the benefits of. Have some reading:
http://tanalin.com/en/articles/lossless-scaling/
It's the sharpest you can get those assets, without redrawing them (or adding horrible ringing). Do you want Beamdog to redraw the artwork for this game? Because I don't believe they'll able to do that properly and I'm sure people will complain if they do.
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PeterScott: The portion I pointed out before; the Player portrait and nearby UI elements are Obviously NOT integer (AKA nearest neighbor) scaling.

IS/NN produces obvious pronounced jaggies as pixels are just doubled up. That isn't what happened here.

Engage your brain before you lecture people on things you clearly don't grasp.
What's with the needless vitriol? First calling me an apologist and shill for no reason and now implying I'm not actually using my brain... What did I ever do to you?

I looked at a better comparison image and found out you were right and the Enhanced Edition does not use integer scaling. Yes integer scaling produces more jagged edges if the source is very low resolution, but I haven't played Neverwinter Nights in ages and didn't remember just how low resolution the assets were. That mistake is on me.

However, you can't blame me entirely for being confused, you originally said they were directly doubled (which seems to indicate integer scaling) and posting a comparison screenshot that made no sense.

I've attached a screenshot comparing how Beamdog scales (right image) and how I ideally want it scaled (left image). Though I really can't blame Beamdog for not doing it the way I want, people generally seem to prefer the smoothed look. Which is why you should advocate for them offering options, not saying the way they're doing it is wrong (because it would suck if that way would no longer be possible).
Attachments:
untitled.png (189 Kb)
Posted November 24, 2017
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ZellSF: What's with the needless vitriol? First calling me an apologist and shill for no reason and now implying I'm not actually using my brain... What did I ever do to you?
Because it seems like you bending over backwards to make excuses for beamdog, and going as far to lie repeatedly to me.

When I first posted the image comparison you erroneously stated I had destroyed it with JPG compression and that is why it was blurry (false).

So I posted a link to the original, and then you then acted like they were radically different than the crop I posted, which is again false,and claimed you could now see that it was integer scaling, again false.

So falsehood after falsehood...

Anyone can compare the left side of the crop you posted to the one I posted and see that they are essentially the same.

Disingenuous behavior is annoying.
Posted November 24, 2017
low rated
Jeez, this thread is a train-wreck. It seems talking about the game in a positive light is frowned upon on these forums for some reason - and is like trying to ice-skate up-hill.

It doesn't seem to matter if all you did was come to the forum excited about the game, trying to find out information on it and providing some yourself. In-fact, providing said information could even label you as doing "damage-control", being a "shill" and/or defending the developers. It's the mindset of some truly vitriol users that are on some kind of pedantic crusade to ensure anyone interested in the game knows they are wrong to be (according to these people).

@ZellSF: Be careful, as they will push the "victim" card on you next, as if they are saints that have done no wrong. Note: the whole of this thread is a good read as evidence for all this. It's a haters/trolls paradise, who cannot understand that some of us take a more "balanced" approached to things.

How about we drop this hostile attitude? Some people obviously have issues with Beamdog - and that is fine. In-fact, I think we all appreciate the information (I did until it turned nasty). However, when it turns into this bitter, hostile, hate-filled rant it gets no-one anywhere.

I came to these forums in the hope of finding out more information on the game - and this thread is what I got. I must say, it doesn't fill me with confidence for the GOG community at all.
Posted November 24, 2017
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bioshark: Just a quick hint to all the Beamdog haters out there:

1) Yes, they have bundled EE with the Classical one.
BUT....
2) In the EE back-up and goodies, you can claim the a copy of the Classical game
3) Once that game is on your shelve, you have access to it's back-up and goodies, including the SOUNDTRACK!

So, please don't say that you lost the soundtracks.

It is also true that they are selling the EE soundtracks separately. The reasons for this could be:
- FLAC version not available by default
- EE version contains extra songs (at least in BG series)
- people who don't own the game can buy only the soundtrack if they wish?

All in all I support Beamdog because they at least try to keep the legacy alive. Fixing bugs, modernizing the look a bit, and most importantly keeping games up to date with modern hardware requirements.

Ok, now I wait for the "haters" to hit me :)
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Stig79: That is not true, and you know it. You get a copy of the Classic version if you buy the EE game, but the soundtrack is not included anymore (they removed it when they started selling the soundtracks separately). If you bought the classics before the EE versions were out, you still have the soundtrack included with those. You just don't get it via the EE version.

The copy of the classic version you claim via the EE version doesn't show up on your shelf either. It is just treated as an extra under the EE version.

Stop telling lies, please.

And Beamdog trying to keep the legacy of those games alive? Come on. Those games were the highest selling games on GoG even after the EE versions came out. The legacy was very much alive. Beamdog just bundled them so they could get all the income from both versions.

And fixing bugs? The classics, on GoG, were bug free. Never played them, did you? The EE versions, however, are still a buggy mess and they get biggier each time Beamdog patches them.

If you love the EE games, great. But don't lie about them to get people to buy them or support Beamdog.

https://s7.postimg.org/sn2wblua3/beamdog_soundtrack.png No soundtrack here....just an installer for the classic game. Nothing else.

You don't get this version on your shelf if you install it via the EE version either.
Since there are serious accusations dropped in this discussion, let me jump in and clear everything in regards what is available when you buy IWD EE on GOG.
Yes, the Enhanced Edition doesn't have the soundtrack as bonus material. But if you go to "My Account" and click on the IWD EE you will see a notification saying "Icewind Dale Classic Edition gift code in now available in the "more" -> "serial keys" section." - this means you get a code to redeem the classic version of the game that was sold on GOG before EE edition was released. The classic edition includes all bonus content that was available previously, including the soundtack.

@Stig79 before you start accusing people on the forums that they are liars, check if things that you talk about are correct. Please, let's keep these forums a cool place for all of us, after all e're here because we love games.

EDIT: changed NWN to IWD
Post edited November 24, 2017 by elcook
Posted November 24, 2017
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ZellSF: What's with the needless vitriol? First calling me an apologist and shill for no reason and now implying I'm not actually using my brain... What did I ever do to you?
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PeterScott: Because it seems like you bending over backwards to make excuses for beamdog, and going as far to lie repeatedly to me.

When I first posted the image comparison you erroneously stated I had destroyed it with JPG compression and that is why it was blurry (false).

So I posted a link to the original, and then you then acted like they were radically different than the crop I posted, which is again false,and claimed you could now see that it was integer scaling, again false.

So falsehood after falsehood...

Anyone can compare the left side of the crop you posted to the one I posted and see that they are essentially the same.

Disingenuous behavior is annoying.
jpg compression did make the image more blurry (I suppose "unclear" would be the better word here). Nothing false about pointing out that for image scaling comparisons on small images with lots of detail, you really should not be using jpg compression.

Then you posted a link to the original and I did not claim it was radically different than the one you posted. I claimed it was easier to see what sort of image scaling algorithm could have been used now that it wasn't suffering from double jpg compression.

Misremembering the resolution of the assets made me misread the image as integer scaling when it wasn't. I already admitted I was wrong here.

The left image in the comparison I posted looks nowhere the same as either of the images you posted. Are you sure you didn't mean to say the right image in my comparison looks like the one you posted? Because that one should, that's the screenshot from the Enhanced Edition.
Posted November 24, 2017
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elcook: Yes, the Enhanced Edition doesn't have the soundtrack as bonus material. But if you go to "My Account" and click on the NWN EE you will see a notification saying "Icewind Dale Classic Edition gift code in now available in the "more" -> "serial keys" section." - this means you get a code to redeem the classic version of the game that was sold on GOG before EE edition was released. The classic edition includes all bonus content that was available previously, including the soundtack.
Is the soundtrack (also?) being sold separately?
Posted November 24, 2017
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elcook: Yes, the Enhanced Edition doesn't have the soundtrack as bonus material. But if you go to "My Account" and click on the NWN EE you will see a notification saying "Icewind Dale Classic Edition gift code in now available in the "more" -> "serial keys" section." - this means you get a code to redeem the classic version of the game that was sold on GOG before EE edition was released. The classic edition includes all bonus content that was available previously, including the soundtack.
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Bookwyrm627: Is the soundtrack (also?) being sold separately?
We don't have the soundtrack sold separately in our offer.
Posted November 24, 2017
Will be also price increase for the patch-like "enhancements" as it happened with PST?
Posted November 24, 2017
low rated
It's nice to see a mod stepped in with some facts at last. Quite ironic really, considering it was Stig accusing bioshark of lying, when it was the reverse that was true. Good to know that the classic version will still be available for purchasers of the Enhanced Edition.

I also looked into the premium modules thing and apparently the EE of NWN ships with 3 premium modules, while another 3 are "DLC" (or included in the package with the Deluxe edition). Apparently this is due to licensing or some-such (quotes below):

"We include everything that was in the Diamond Edition, and then the premium modules that were previously available to purchase from BioWare are offered as a part of Digital Deluxe (Beamdog) and DLC (Steam).

The BioWare modules were/are available on fan sites for free, but the position here is that they exist (on fan sites) in sort of a legal gray area."

...and...

"Will I retain ownership of the premium modules I purchased from BioWare?

If you already have the premium modules (Wyvern Crown of Cormyr, Pirates of the Sword Coast, or Infinite Dungeons), they will function properly in Neverwinter Nights: Enhanced Edition."

All-in-all it looks nowhere near as bad as it was made out to be on this thread. Although from what I saw the EE will cost more than the existing "classic" edition.
Posted November 24, 2017
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jimbobslimbob: It's nice to see a mod stepped in with some facts at last. Quite ironic really, considering it was Stig accusing bioshark of lying, when it was the reverse that was true. Good to know that the classic version will still be available for purchasers of the Enhanced Edition.
That isn't stated. Just that is how it works for IWD EE.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
Neverwinter Nights seriesBuy NWN1 ASAP.(140 posts)(140 posts)
(140 posts)