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I'm fond of RPGs but my first trial of the genre was Oblivion. Graphics wise though I'm a 90s kid so I could stomach VGA graphics I suppose. I still enjoy early 90s point and click games. A 2d RPG seems unattractive though.

I know people will have grown up loving this game and still love it. So while it has great reviews on here I think that's part of the reason.

But what about people who've started playing it in the last decade after starting with modern games though?

Does it still hold up?
Hmmm well there's the bag inventory which requires you to be OCD and be super careful with how you pack your things...

Spoony's review of Ultima 7 is recommended, as for how it plays today? I am not sure, I never played it. I know I probably would never beat it.

Ultima 7 - The Black Gate
Ultima 7b - Serpent Isle

Ultima Retrospective (<i>4 hours</i>)
I'm not quite who you are looking for (I grew up mainly on older JRPGs like Dragon Warrior 1), but my personal opinion is that Ultima 7 is overrated and not as good as its predecessors. Here are some problems with the game:

1. Combat is atrocious. They decided to make the combat real time, and in doing sol took away the ability to control your companions and any semblance of strategy the combat might have had. While the Ultima series isn't known for spectacular combat, Ultima 3-6 all had better combat than Ultima 7.

2. Food. The Ultima series has always required you to keep your characters fed, but in Ultima 4-6 it was generally a minor concern (especially in 6 where you only need food to rest, and you don't need to rest because MP regenerates on its own). In Ultima 7, however, not only do you need to feed your characters, but simply buying the food isn't enough; you actually need to go into your inventory and manually use the food item on the hungry character.

3. Inventory management is really poor. Ultima 1-5 had unlimited inventory size, and even Ultima 6 at least kept the items in your inventory clearly separated so it wasn't hard to select a particular item. Ultima 7 throws that out the window; you need to hunt for the item you need to use, which in turn makes problem 2 even worse, as you, again, have to manually feed your party members.

Incidentally, I have found that every Ultima game except the first has one serious flaw or annoyance that the previous game in the series did not have.
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dtgreene: I'm not quite who you are looking for (I grew up mainly on older JRPGs like Dragon Warrior 1), but my personal opinion is that Ultima 7 is overrated and not as good as its predecessors. Here are some problems with the game:

1. Combat is atrocious. They decided to make the combat real time, and in doing sol took away the ability to control your companions and any semblance of strategy the combat might have had. While the Ultima series isn't known for spectacular combat, Ultima 3-6 all had better combat than Ultima 7.

2. Food. The Ultima series has always required you to keep your characters fed, but in Ultima 4-6 it was generally a minor concern (especially in 6 where you only need food to rest, and you don't need to rest because MP regenerates on its own). In Ultima 7, however, not only do you need to feed your characters, but simply buying the food isn't enough; you actually need to go into your inventory and manually use the food item on the hungry character.

3. Inventory management is really poor. Ultima 1-5 had unlimited inventory size, and even Ultima 6 at least kept the items in your inventory clearly separated so it wasn't hard to select a particular item. Ultima 7 throws that out the window; you need to hunt for the item you need to use, which in turn makes problem 2 even worse, as you, again, have to manually feed your party members.

Incidentally, I have found that every Ultima game except the first has one serious flaw or annoyance that the previous game in the series did not have.
Come to think of it, how does Ultima 7 compare to Might & Magic 7? Are they similar? Is one clearly better? Are the differences mainly in story?
Pretty well, to be honest. It takes getting used to, but it did when it came out too. Their particular isomorphic projection and the fast, abrupt movement on a limited frame rate are the hardest things to acclimatise to, but if you manage to get used to that you get a game with one of the most interactive worlds and natural storytelling to date.

Obviously I didn't play it for the first time in the last decade, but in my opinion it holds up now just as well as it did at first (bearing in mind that the problems with it were quite apparent back then too - and before GOG it was a also very difficult game to even get working because of its weird memory model).
I am curious too. I wonder if it is better than wizardry 8 continuous mode? (It's not, nothing ever will be(expect maybe Freddi Fish 2(I hope two people argue vehemently over this(I'd pay to see that))))
Post edited December 10, 2016 by Gengar78
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Gengar78: I am curious too. I wonder if it is better than wizardry 8 continuous mode? (It's not, nothing ever will be(expect maybe Freddi Fish 2(I hope two people argue vehemently over this(I'd pay to see that))))
From a combat perspective, Ultima 7 is not better than Wizardry 8's continuous mode. In fact, I believe Ultima 7's combat is even worse than the combat in Planescape: Torment.
If your not from the generation that was playing PC RPG's when this came out, like I was when I first got it, I'd recommend playing something like Planescape: Torment instead, which is much easier to play through. Although I did have a good time with Ultima Underworld 2.
I found the text in Ultima to be unreadable in font and speed. That ended it for me.

Might and Magic was a completely different game. More my style. Dungeons, fppp, readable text. I don't ask for a lot.

Wizardry 8 was something. I never beat it, but I really liked it. The lousy enemy-hardness-to-your-party-level was it's weakest point.

If you haven't played Might and Magic X or Legend of Grimrock, those are excellent modern games in the same vein.
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Gengar78: I am curious too. I wonder if it is better than wizardry 8 continuous mode? (It's not, nothing ever will be(expect maybe Freddi Fish 2(I hope two people argue vehemently over this(I'd pay to see that))))
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dtgreene: From a combat perspective, Ultima 7 is not better than Wizardry 8's continuous mode. In fact, I believe Ultima 7's combat is even worse than the combat in Planescape: Torment.
Waoh! Those are some pretty heavy claims. I'll have to get out my NSA spycam again to fact-check that. Let's see... WOAAOH! There are 8.533 people seriously playing Ultima 7 and 7.4 people semi-seriously playing Planscape: Torment! I don't know, it seems you've gotten your games-that-Gengar78-obviously-knows-about-and-played-before mixed up.
Post edited December 10, 2016 by Gengar78
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dtgreene: I'm not quite who you are looking for (I grew up mainly on older JRPGs like Dragon Warrior 1), but my personal opinion is that Ultima 7 is overrated and not as good as its predecessors. Here are some problems with the game:

1. Combat is atrocious. They decided to make the combat real time, and in doing sol took away the ability to control your companions and any semblance of strategy the combat might have had. While the Ultima series isn't known for spectacular combat, Ultima 3-6 all had better combat than Ultima 7.

2. Food. The Ultima series has always required you to keep your characters fed, but in Ultima 4-6 it was generally a minor concern (especially in 6 where you only need food to rest, and you don't need to rest because MP regenerates on its own). In Ultima 7, however, not only do you need to feed your characters, but simply buying the food isn't enough; you actually need to go into your inventory and manually use the food item on the hungry character.

3. Inventory management is really poor. Ultima 1-5 had unlimited inventory size, and even Ultima 6 at least kept the items in your inventory clearly separated so it wasn't hard to select a particular item. Ultima 7 throws that out the window; you need to hunt for the item you need to use, which in turn makes problem 2 even worse, as you, again, have to manually feed your party members.

Incidentally, I have found that every Ultima game except the first has one serious flaw or annoyance that the previous game in the series did not have.
Just now I'm playing and struggling food management in Ultima 7.
Clearly Ultima 6 was much more friendly game.
Perhaps, Richard Garriott thought that the 7th system was more 'realistic'. but that was wrong realistic for RPG game.
It is a bit easier by using 'F' key though.
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yoshino: Just now I'm playing and struggling food management in Ultima 7.
Clearly Ultima 6 was much more friendly game.
Perhaps, Richard Garriott thought that the 7th system was more 'realistic'. but that was wrong realistic for RPG game.
It is a bit easier by using 'F' key though.
Actually, the original Ultima 7 didn't have the 'F' key shortcut. It was added in Serpent Isle, and the authors of Exult decided to add that feature to U7, but the game didn't originally have it.
Don't let anyone's opinion hold you back, Ultima 7 is amazing period.
Try it for yourself, everyone is different, but Ultima 7 will always be a wonder of the video game world.
I'd love to get into it due to the raving reviews and its status as a classic, but so far what always put me off was mostly the emulation. Neither Dosbox nor Exult seemed to run the game perfectly. Exult was much better than Dosbox for me, less hiccups and sound issues, but it seemed to be missing other parts present in the Dosbox edition, so I could never decide which version to choose (and I'm only talking about the intro here). I think speed and controls might have been issues for me as well. But I don't remember any details now. It just didn't feel right. :/
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yoshino: Perhaps, Richard Garriott thought that the 7th system was more 'realistic'. but that was wrong realistic for RPG game.
Actually, this is one issue that I have had with the series in general; way too often it trades playablility for realism.

In particular, the games would be better IMO if:
* Food were eliminated.
* The reagent system were eliminated or toned down. Perhaps all reagents except Mandrake Root would be eliminated, and spells not requiring Mandrake Root would be made to require no reagents at all (but still require MP).
* Ranged weapons didn't need ammo. (None of them are really strong enough to warrant it, particularly in Ultima 5 with the Magic Axe (stronger than any bow and doesn't need ammo) and Ultima 6 where ammo is heavier than the reagents needed to use magic as your primary form of offense.
* Ultima 6 and onward had retained Ultima 5's inventory system where you didn't need to worry about weight (except for equipped items) and inventory management. (To put it in perspective, the Final Fantasy series adopted this approach in the 5th installment and has only diverged from that for the MMOs and for cases where individual items had stats that can change; the Ultima series took the opposite approach with its 6th installment.)
* The overworld and towns didn't become pitch black during the night.
* Ultima 5 didn't have the shadowlords appearing in town.